Sr 6.1: Behind Again?

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  • BootAble – FreeDOS boot testing freeware

    To obtain direct, low-level access to a system's mass storage drives, SpinRite runs under a GRC-customized version of FreeDOS which has been modified to add compatibility with all file systems. In order to run SpinRite it must first be possible to boot FreeDOS.

    GRC's “BootAble” freeware allows anyone to easily create BIOS-bootable media in order to workout and confirm the details of getting a machine to boot FreeDOS through a BIOS. Once the means of doing that has been determined, the media created by SpinRite can be booted and run in the same way.

    The participants here, who have taken the time to share their knowledge and experience, their successes and some frustrations with booting their computers into FreeDOS, have created a valuable knowledgebase which will benefit everyone who follows.

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PaulK

New member
Aug 5, 2026
2
0
I started with Spinrite at 6.0 and eventually faced the greater than 2tb limitation, losing a 3tb TiVo drive to a competitor's product. Only one of my current 5 pcs is old enough to boot Spinrite; the others are UEFI-only. To maintain them, I have to remove their M2 SSD modules and connect them to the old PC via a USB 3 adapter. This is suboptimal and beyond the capabilities of the typical consumer, as is creating her own UEFI boot disk where it is even possible.

6.0 was functionally obsolete for many years as disks exceeded 2tb and now 6.1 is in the same place because it won't boot on most, if not all, Intel/AMD pcs sold today.

Now Steve wants to work on some other pet projects before getting back to version 7, which will catch up with modern hardware. Waiting through SQRL to break the 2tb limit was tough enough; do we have to do it again?

We're expecting to pay an upgrade fee for 7.x. Shouldn't that revenue stream be enough incentive for Steve to move on it? That bread needs some buttering (shout out to Leo).

I've sent several emails to Steve about at least getting us a UEFI version. He hasn't responded. I'm not sure if something short of a complete rewrite can do that, though.
 
Steve has the luxury of proceeding on the projects he wants to at a pace that he wants to. I'm sure you're not the only one wanting him to move on to do the thing that you want, but I don't think there is any amount of whining that is going to change his mind away from the schedule he's already got in mind.

Aside from the various work-arounds (involving virtual machines or whatnot,) there are other choices you could make if you're having trouble with SpinRite and UEFI machines.
 
There have always been alternatives to SpinRite.

What is it about SpinRite that we like and return to?

For me, I think it's that under initial challenges from Dan Bricklin's
Demo program, SpinRite has always communicated and controlled
well, plus, of course, @Steve Gibson has always taken great pride
in both - clear, clean communications, with tons of information - plus,
flexible user tweaking.


And what is it about the alternatives that we use only when we
can't use SpinRite?


Even going out of our way to "game the system" and run SpinRite in
a virtual machine?

For me, other programs' communications and controls are a bit more
mysterious, expecting us to accept the programmer's 'wisdom'
without our own tweaking, and not communicating what happened
as fully as SpinRite.


What are other people's experiences?
 
I've sent several emails to Steve about at least getting us a UEFI version. He hasn't responded. I'm not sure if something short of a complete rewrite can do that, though.
You can always try running SpinRite in a virtual machine (VirtualBox) on your UEFI machine as documented elsewhere on this forum.
 
We're expecting to pay an upgrade fee for 7.x. Shouldn't that revenue stream be enough incentive for Steve to move on it? That bread needs some buttering (shout out to Leo).

The problem is that SpinRIte 7 will be a major project taking years, probably five or six years at least based on his prior projects. That's a long time to wait for revenue. The other two projects he has planned first will take less time and generate revenue streams a lot sooner.

I've sent several emails to Steve about at least getting us a UEFI version. He hasn't responded. I'm not sure if something short of a complete rewrite can do that, though.

Steve's plans for SpinRite 7 have changed. He's no longer planning to do a standalone program that boots up. Instead it's going to run under Windows. That will take care of the UEFI issues but it will require major rewrites.
 
We're expecting to pay an upgrade fee for 7.x. Shouldn't that revenue stream be enough incentive for Steve to move on it?

I suspect the SpinRite sales have been lagging of late due to SpinRite’s major shortcomings/handicaps:

1) SpinRite is 100% incompatible with EUFI booting, thus eliminating its direct use on all newer systems that are EUFI boot only.
(Yes there are workarounds, but they are somewhat complicated and not for the faint of heart.)

2) SpinRite’s USB support is only through the BIOS. Thus SpinRite is severely limited/handicapped by the BIOS when accessing external USB drives.

3) SpinRite lacks native drivers for internal M2 NVMe drives and external USB drives.

SpinRite 7 would resolve these issues, and thus become a major improvement for SpinRite, and ought to again be a major revenue source for GRC. But: It will take some time to get there. Thus there is a current need for other revenue sources for GRC.

DNSBench V2 has been developed and released as a commercial product and a new revenue source for GRC.

The current plan seems to be to develop and release ValiDrive v2 and Beyond Recall v1 as additional interim revenue sources for GRC and then proceed to SpinRite 7 development.
 
Steve's plans for SpinRite 7 have changed. He's no longer planning to do a standalone program that boots up. Instead it's going to run under Windows. That will take care of the UEFI issues but it will require major rewrites.
I am of the opinion that the future of SpinRite 7 is very much undecided at this point.

At one time Steve was Gung Ho with the RTOS-32 approach. This would have produced a pure 32 bit SpinRite app readily capable of running in either a UEFI or Bios environment, with absolutely no dependencies on either. And this approach would have seemingly unlimited ability to easily add new features to SpinRite 7.

Then subsequent ruminations indicated he was leaning towards SpinRite 7 being a full Windows app. One aspect I do not recall his commenting on was how he planned to handle SpinRite-ing a drive that Windows has portions of reserved for its own exclusive use.

And then. after that, subsequent ruminations indicated he was leaning back towards RTOS-32 again.

The bottom line seems to be: Steve likely has not had the luxury of having the time, free from other distractions, to really think about SpinRite 7 and how he will deal with it. Until then I feel the future of SpinRite is yet to be determined.
 
I started with Spinrite at 6.0 and eventually faced the greater than 2tb limitation, losing a 3tb TiVo drive to a competitor's product. Only one of my current 5 pcs is old enough to boot Spinrite; the others are UEFI-only. To maintain them, I have to remove their M2 SSD modules and connect them to the old PC via a USB 3 adapter. This is suboptimal and beyond the capabilities of the typical consumer, as is creating her own UEFI boot disk where it is even possible.

6.0 was functionally obsolete for many years as disks exceeded 2tb and now 6.1 is in the same place because it won't boot on most, if not all, Intel/AMD pcs sold today.

Now Steve wants to work on some other pet projects before getting back to version 7, which will catch up with modern hardware. Waiting through SQRL to break the 2tb limit was tough enough; do we have to do it again?

We're expecting to pay an upgrade fee for 7.x. Shouldn't that revenue stream be enough incentive for Steve to move on it? That bread needs some buttering (shout out to Leo).

I've sent several emails to Steve about at least getting us a UEFI version. He hasn't responded. I'm not sure if something short of a complete rewrite can do that, though.
How much do you pay for monthly Spinrite support?
 
Tools.

These are just tools.

And I love tools, and I collect them.

And for me, my most important mechanical tool is a file, because it
help me build other tools.

"... Spinrite 6.0 faced the greater than 2tb limitation ..."​

If I recall, the command line:

SPINRITE FORCE DYNASTAT 0​

... would let SpinRite 6.0 'work' on up-to 2 TB of any drive, and that
often addressed my 'problem' and let me make an informed decision.

"... a 3tb TiVo drive to a competitor's product ..."​

I presume HD Regenerator from our esteemed colleague Dmitriy
Primochenko
via Abstradome DPOSoft.com.

Did it do the job?

"... Only one of my current 5 pcs is old enough to boot Spinrite; the ​
others are UEFI-only ..."​

Yes, Intel saw royalties going elsewhere and so abandoned purchases
of IBM-compatible BIOS from Phoenix Technologies, American
Megatrends ( AMI ), and Award Software. ;-)

"... To maintain them, I have to remove their M2 SSD modules and ​
connect them to the old PC via a USB 3 adapter ..."​

If they are M.2 SATA, of course they can go in SATA adapters and run
as fast as possible.

If they are M.2 NVMe PCIe, then USB, and we're limited to USB2 sockets
... or virtual machine may work directly at higest speed.

Of course, once in USB adapters, a quick scan with @Steve Gibson's
own free ValiDrive will give a quick test and report across the drive,
and that works under a running Windows, even at USB3+ speeds.

C'mon, folks, run ValiDrive on anythying and everything that can be
presented as USB storage - I have ValiDrive test HDDs and SSDs,
as well as Kindles and such, all the time.

Of course Linux and Mac folks have always had to use workarounds,
creating supplemental tools, to use SpinRite and now Validrive.

"...This is suboptimal and beyond the capabilities of the typical ​
consumer, as is creating her own UEFI boot disk where it is even ​
possible ..."​

Yes, also missing for newbies is the experience and savvy of
interpreting the process and results - what's normal, what's good,
what's bad, what's fixable, what's not?

Without experience, how would anyone know?

So we write into GRC Forums and GRC Newsgroups.

"... 6.0 was functionally obsolete for many years ..."​

Sadly, Steve blamed the BIOS for 20 years, but our own @Paul F
recently discovered SpinRite 6 had a programming goof, easily
remedied:

https://forums.grc.com/threads/a-patch-for-a-spinrite-v6-0-overflow.1232/

https://www.grc.com/sr/kb/b04e.htm

"... disks exceeded 2tb and now 6.1 is in the same place because it ​
won't boot on most, if not all, Intel/AMD pcs sold today ..."​

Hence, keeping an older computer to do data recovery and drive
maintenance.

Even with new computers under our fingertips, an old computer
somewhere to do maintenance for us has become a reasonable and
inexpensive avenue of self-support.

The original SpinRite target was data recovery and drive
maintenance in place
, because computers and drives were
expensive, and few people had old PCs hanging around that could
pitch in to provide offline services.

Nowadays, almost everyone may have a spare PC someplace, and
old PCs can be bought on the cheap from many sources, so there's
that.

One of the best sequences I've used is to clone out using ddrescue
on a Linux boot USB drive, letting it run multiple times until every
recoverable sector has been copied or proven unreadable, see
web search ddrescue for an overview.

Since drives are now cheap, there's no reason to worry over the
original drive, I only wanted the data.

But if we want to reuse a drive, and we want to verify a drive's qualities,
which I do for all drives, new, refurbished, or used, then I use a cheap
old computer, and run SpinRite Level 5, then read it multiple times
using free HDDScan from our esteemed collegue Artem Rubtsov, and
repeatedly run a complete read test over and over for a few days to see
if the drive degrades or stays responsive.

For me, old SSDs often degrade quickly after SpinRite Level 5, but
HDDs seem to stay reliable afterwards, though I do have to clean the
contacts between the drive's circuit card and the drive body
.

But my data has already moved on to a well-proven alternative drive.

We all have our approaches.

That's mine, but it's flexible, dependent on the particulars of each drive
and tool.

I do not expect SpinRite 7 to completely replace my suite of other
tools or my variety of other procedures, because every drive goes
wonky in it's own way.

It's good to have alternatives, and I compare them to each other to
"test the test", so to speak, to build my experience of ... what's normal,
what's good, what's bad, what's fixable, what's not.

And it's good to connect with others to learn what other people's
alternatives are.

I look forward to SpinRite 7.

I especially look forward to SpinRite 7 development, as folks throw all
sorts of unexpected challenges at each beta test version - SpinRite 6.1
development
had a sequence of more than 100 test versions, plus the
evolution of support utilities along the way, such as AHCI, ReadSpeed,
and various drive and memory checkers, as well as the mini Edit
program, and tweaks to FreeDOS.

And the evolution of the industry will not stop, see
web search beyond NVMe and PCIe for a quick exploration of Compute
Express Link (CXL), GPU-Direct and DPU Acceleration, Molecular and
Sub-Atomic Media, DNA Data Storage, Holographic and 5D Optical
Storage, and Quantum Storage - SpinRite 7 may address more than
we know today
.

And there's old tech that's still in use, such as Intel Optane, the
technology that would have satiated the AI industry, but it was before
it's time, marketed as expensive, and now no one is building it - who
else is doing data recovery and drive maintenance on Optane?

ValiDrive tested an Optane SSD in a USB adapter just fine, while
cloning software saw 0 bytes!

C'mon, folks, run ValiDrive on anythying and everything that can be
presented as USB storage!

So hang in there, folks, keep using whatever tools and workarounds
we need, and know that if and when Steve gets around to Spinrite 7,
it'll be a unique-as-ever Steve Gibson presentation, with features
and benefits only Steve can come up with during his deep dives into
the technology, seeing things as only Steve Gibson sees things.
 
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How much do you pay for monthly Spinrite support?
I'm sure he pays about as much for monthly Spinrite support as he's getting.

The core assumption in your comment is that people wouldn't pay for this support, but this forum post is literally proving the opposite when people are in here willing to pay for a version that has modern support.

Your argument isn't accurate, nor is it constructive.
 
How much do you pay for monthly
Your argument isn't accurate, nor is it constructive
I think you both have valid points, and I think you need to remember to keep things here friendly and not be sniping at each other.

The facts remain the same. Steve is a one man team, and he has one mind, and none of you bickering about his decisions are going to influence his thinking.
 
The facts remain the same. Steve is a one man team, and he has one mind, and none of you bickering about his decisions are going to influence his thinking.
I agree and it's understandable. As are people who like his product being frustrated that they can't use it anymore, even when they're willing to plop down more cash for it.

He's not in any way shape or form required to update his software for us, and it's also understandable that people might be desperately looking forward to a newer version that is compatible with modern computers.

There's nothing wrong with calling any of these things out on either side, but when someone makes a bad faith argument like that, implying that they haven't paid for anything, thus have no right to complain, it ends up being quite toxic, and reflects poorly on this community.

I was here, considering buying a license for 6.1 as I have a failed drive I'm trying to recover currently, but knowing full well that until 7 comes out, the usefulness of SR will be limited, and only fit my current usecase on my 15 year old laptop.

I was hoping to get an idea of how long I might have to wait for 7, to see if I shoud just buy 6.1 now and upgrade to 7 later, or wait for 7 if it's just around the corner.

Seeing a comment like
How much do you pay for monthly Spinrite support?
to a concern like mine, when I'm actively considering becoming a customer is quite off putting, and actually made me decide against SR for the time being, and to try to find other alternatives instead.

Not a great way for a community to put their best foot forward, and has just caused a lost sale to me.

I was also considering buying a corporate license, as I run an it business, and have been considering data recovery as possible service I could offer.

I may reevaluate in the future, but I was ready to buy today until I read that comment.
 
Defensiveness is attack - why waste time on that, who wins, and wins
what?

Complaints are compliments - at least they are HERE letting folks
know their need exists, and offering a potential customer.

- - - - -

Considering alternatives ... we've always had alternatives, before
SpinRite, and after.

I have every SpinRite from v0 to v6.1.

And I still have every alternative.

Bacuase every drive and every computer is different.

I tried buying computers to run SpinRite, if SpinRite failed, the
comptuer went back.

Same with ComboFix as a determinant on what computer to trust -
if ComboFix can't run, do I really want to use that computer?

Not everyone stays on Windows 7, and I have reluctantly included
all Windows - 8 ( ! ), 8,1, 10, 11 ( alreay having Windows 3.11, 95,
98, XP, ME, 2000 and whatever servers ).

- - - - -

For those who don't want to disassemble their UEFI computer, or
can't ( I have some laptops with soldered-in SSDs ), WTG Windows
To Go on a USB boot drive can setup a virtual machine and then
SpinRite can dance!

It's comlicated, with many steps, but I have made it work, and it was
scary beautiful:

https://forums.grc.com/threads/how-to-run-spinrite-on-a-uefi-only-machine-part-1-of-5.1613/
 
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Seeing a comment like
How much do you pay for monthly Spinrite support?
to a concern like mine, when I'm actively considering becoming a customer is quite off putting, and actually made me decide against SR for the time being, and to try to find other alternatives instead.

Not a great way for a community to put their best foot forward, and has just caused a lost sale to me.

I was also considering buying a corporate license, as I run an it business, and have been considering data recovery as possible service I could offer.

I may reevaluate in the future, but I was ready to buy today until I read that comment.

It seems like this could be a hasty judgement call based on a single comment by just one individual.

This is not the general view of the members in these forums. Sure we would all like to have SpinRite 7 now with its major improvements. Who would not? In general (with the inevitable exceptions) we here in these forums are a patient lot. We know Steve is just one person, with his priorities. One of those priorities has to be the sustainability of GRC the business. SpinRite 7 will be a multi-year development (2 minimum, quite likely more - just my WAG) before it produces revenue.

Hence the need for shorter term projects (DNSBench v2, ValiDrive v2, Beyond Recall v1) to provide interim revenue for GRC the business.

If a potential customer has a justifiable use for a SpinRite license to support existing older equipment now - and to provide financial support for GRC the business - then that would seem to me to be a no brainer.

Just my $0.02. YMMV.
 
It seems like this could be a hasty judgement call based on a single comment by just one individual.

This is not the general view of the members in these forums. Sure we would all like to have SpinRite 7 now with its major improvements. Who would not? In general (with the inevitable exceptions) we here in these forums are a patient lot. We know Steve is just one person, with his priorities. One of those priorities has to be the sustainability of GRC the business. SpinRite 7 will be a multi-year development (2 minimum, quite likely more - just my WAG) before it produces revenue.

Hence the need for short term projects (ValiDrive V2, Beyond Recall v1) to provide interim revenue for GRC the business. If a potential customer has a justifiable use for a SpinRite license to support existing older equipment now - and to provide financial support for GRC the business - then that would seem to me to be a no brainer.

Just my $0.02. YMMV.
Hmm. No.

I've been developing software for over 50 years. Commercial software, enterprise software, operating system software, and open source software. And during that time I've also done system administration. When people buy once (without a support contract), they have expectations. As an open source developer who donates time, for free, people have similar expectations. IMO people people who have purchased a single SpinRite license, for an inexpensive cost, a new version IMO is outside the parameters for the purchase of a single version of a product, unless that product includes major version updates.

I'm not a SpinRite customer -- I use FreeBSD tools. But as a software developer who has been the target of this kind of attitude many times, I object to the sense of entitlement when that entitlement exceeds the scope of the contract or license. Steve will produce SpinRite 7 when he finishes it. People should exercise patience.

Been in that situation many times. It's disrespectful.
 
Writing to the Intenet versus speaking to someone we know in the
same room are totally different environments and "rules".

I can "get away" with saying teasing rude stuff in person, a comment
the we both know is essentially wink-wink harmless, understood, but
the same comment palls in the dead air of the public Intenet.

Wanting SpinRite 7 toute suite has nothing to do with paying for any
previous version of SpinRite.

Anybody can express such a longing.

Even though the opening poster mentioned owning SpinRite 6, and
thereby getting the immensely upgraded SpinRite 6.1 after 20 years
at no further charge <-- no other vendor I have ever seen has ever
offered such "support".

So 2 things are worthy of revisiting on the part of various
commentors here:

1 - wanting SpinRite 7 has nothing to do with paying anythying ever.

2 - getting SpinRite 6.1 free after 20-years of SpinRite 6 is incredibly
generous "support".

- - - - -

Now, slap whatever storage you've got into a USB adapter, and let the
free GRC ValiDrive 1 - a mini SpinRite 7 Level 5 - have at it, and tell
us what you find.

And write your "thank you" to @Steve Gibson for all three:

SpinRite 6,​
​
SpinRite 6.1,​
​
and Validrive 1.​

And thank @Scott for cobbling together how to run current and previous
versions of SpinRite in virtual machines on just about any storage
technology available today:

https://forums.grc.com/threads/how-to-run-spinrite-on-a-uefi-only-machine-part-1-of-5.1613/

Let's do that!
 
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A tip of the hat to those who can get SpinRite 6.x to fire on a UEFI-only boot machine with a virtual or emulated this or that. I'm patiently waiting for whatever SpinRite 7.0 will be in its initial roll-out. A build that UEFI-boots right off the hop would be neat (I have a version of MemTest that already can UEFI boot from a USB stick). If RTOS can help with that, great. I read bits and bites of some ruminating that maybe the new version might run as a Windows app (10? 11?). If one can get past all that M$ code to drill down into the machine and still wring out some performance that's worth an "atta boy". I'm on the notify list. Will be excited to take SpinRite 7 for a test drive when it's available.
 
As to what I used on my 3tb TiVo drive I can't recall as it was years ago. Whatever it was, it trashed the drive. I let the TiVo rebuild a fresh drive. Luckily I was able to archive most of the shows I wanted to keep off of the TiVo as the drive started to fail.

I didn't consider the immediate revenue angle several mention. I don't spend much time here and don't recall Steve suggesting it as a factor on SN. For me, at least, those short-term revenue raisers aren't particularly attractive. I might purchase them just to support Steve beyond my Club TWIT membership, but I don't see the general populace doing so. I'd just like a sense that Steve is going to get to it reasonably soon. The side-trips, especially SQRL, don't lead in that direction.
 
I'd just like a sense that Steve is going to get to it reasonably soon.
Steve's personal life has thrown him a few detours recently. He got married, then he decided to build a new home with his new wife and in the middle of all that he found out he needed eye surgery. It's all kept him pretty sidelined the last half a year or more. It seems likely to continue to sideline him for another 6 months or so. Hopefully he'll come out of all the chaos newly recharged, and maybe with a new ability provided him with the help of an AI coding buddy as he has been studying up on all the tech and seems fairly confident in its abilities now.