on steve's lost crypto

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phish

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Jan 7, 2021
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does anyone else find it exceedingly suspicious that he would posit a story about losing his crypto? we're talking about a man who understands security, back-ups and not to mention an expert in the area of data recovery :unsure:
 
Sep 17, 2020
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does anyone else find it exceedingly suspicious that he would posit a story about losing his crypto? we're talking about a man who understands security, back-ups and not to mention an expert in the area of data recovery :unsure:
If you had millions of $ in your house, would you advertise it?
 

DiskTuna

Well-known member
Jan 3, 2021
93
10
Netherlands
We can be paranoid about anything. I am aware of multiple cases where people forgot about their wallet or whatever it's called (no expert on this) that they had stored on some disk, somewhere from days where they mined for fun. Years later they suddenly remember that what wasn't worth a lot back then now probably is. And now they can't find the drive or find the flash drive is unreadable.
 

PHolder

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Sep 16, 2020
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Ontario, Canada
I don't think you understand the context. When BitCoin was new (which is when Steve played with it) it wasn't worth anything.... like at all... it was simply an intellectual curiosity at that time. There would be no harm is losing something worthless. Yes, a decade or more later it became quite valuable, but unless @Steve has a time machine, it would be difficult to go back and stop whatever caused him to rewrite the HD in question.

In the early days of BTC mining (before it became hard to get video cards used for mining) I used an Intel 4770 and an AMD 8750 GPU to mine some LTC in a pool. I had a mis-operation of my PC and lost the password to a wallet containing like 0.5BTC ... :( Sh*t happens.
 
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Warwagon

Active member
Sep 20, 2020
25
13
I really don't want to think about it because at the time the machine Steve used to mine his 50 bitcoin, I had the EXACT same CPU :( Yet I didn't mine for coins. I'm pretty sure he said he Mined on a i7 920.
 
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Steve

(as in GRC)
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Feb 1, 2019
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Yeah. It's a little back "Shuttle" cube that I still have sitting here. It's now running Win7 and a whole bunch of instances of Windows Performance monitor to watch the various counters in my remote Windows servers.

Several times during the rise of Bitcoin, I have made VERY sure — and I mean very sure — that I do not still have that Bitcoin wallet around anywhere. A lot of my environment is very static, since I'm of the “if it ain't broke leave it alone” philosophy. (Which is why, among many other things, SpinRite got as old as it has.) So I'm 100% certain of the machine that once minted the coins, and I =DO= recall reformatting and resetting up that machine, likely moving it from WinXP to Win7 where it is now. And, due to the fact that I once used that machine to rip DVD's to MP4's, the drive has been well over-written.

Since I have no interest in going to prison, there is no question that I would report any such Bitcoin “income” to the IRS. So there was never any need for me to keep it's possible existence a secret. Consequently, I have been completely forthcoming about this from the start. And, again... I did at several points perform an extremely thorough search for any possibility that those coins might have survived. Sadly, the fact that 50 were spontaneously created was, at the time, just a fun event since they were worth very little at the time.
 

phish

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Jan 7, 2021
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Yeah. It's a little back "Shuttle" cube that I still have sitting here. It's now running Win7 and a whole bunch of instances of Windows Performance monitor to watch the various counters in my remote Windows servers.

Several times during the rise of Bitcoin, I have made VERY sure — and I mean very sure — that I do not still have that Bitcoin wallet around anywhere. A lot of my environment is very static, since I'm of the “if it ain't broke leave it alone” philosophy. (Which is why, among many other things, SpinRite got as old as it has.) So I'm 100% certain of the machine that once minted the coins, and I =DO= recall reformatting and resetting up that machine, likely moving it from WinXP to Win7 where it is now. And, due to the fact that I once used that machine to rip DVD's to MP4's, the drive has been well over-written.

Since I have no interest in going to prison, there is no question that I would report any such Bitcoin “income” to the IRS. So there was never any need for me to keep it's possible existence a secret. Consequently, I have been completely forthcoming about this from the start. And, again... I did at several points perform an extremely thorough search for any possibility that those coins might have survived. Sadly, the fact that 50 were spontaneously created was, at the time, just a fun event since they were worth very little at the time.

that's a good story steve, except your long-time listeners know it's just not true. check out the transcripts for episode 444:

Leo: Why would anyone put bitcoins in Mt. Gox? It's not a bank. You can have your own bitcoin wallet.


Steve: Yes. And people have all been asking me, where are your 50 bitcoins, Steve? And I just say they're offline. They're not in any computer. They're in a wallet stored on a thumb drive that is sitting in a drawer. I mean, it's just like no one should, I mean, the only thing you would do is you would move them into Mt. Gox in order to liquidate them.
 

Steve

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Well, to the best of my recollection, it's (sadly) true that they are not in any computer!
I'm afraid that they almost certainly no longer exist in any digital storage medium. :mad:
 

Warwagon

Active member
Sep 20, 2020
25
13
Yeah. It's a little back "Shuttle" cube that I still have sitting here. It's now running Win7 and a whole bunch of instances of Windows Performance monitor to watch the various counters in my remote Windows servers.

Several times during the rise of Bitcoin, I have made VERY sure — and I mean very sure — that I do not still have that Bitcoin wallet around anywhere. A lot of my environment is very static, since I'm of the “if it ain't broke leave it alone” philosophy. (Which is why, among many other things, SpinRite got as old as it has.) So I'm 100% certain of the machine that once minted the coins, and I =DO= recall reformatting and resetting up that machine, likely moving it from WinXP to Win7 where it is now. And, due to the fact that I once used that machine to rip DVD's to MP4's, the drive has been well over-written.

Since I have no interest in going to prison, there is no question that I would report any such Bitcoin “income” to the IRS. So there was never any need for me to keep it's possible existence a secret. Consequently, I have been completely forthcoming about this from the start. And, again... I did at several points perform an extremely thorough search for any possibility that those coins might have survived. Sadly, the fact that 50 were spontaneously created was, at the time, just a fun event since they were worth very little at the time.
I dunno, for 2 million dollars i'd still check to see if the impossible was possible for the fun of it! :D Plus it would still be a thrill ride even if you had a 1 in 100,000,0000 million chance! Though if you ever did refill that drive to capacity, ya it's probably gone.
 

Warwagon

Active member
Sep 20, 2020
25
13
Let's also not forget Bitcoin Pizza day!

On May 22, 2010, now known as Bitcoin Pizza Day, Laszlo Hanyecz agreed to pay 10,000 Bitcoins for two delivered Papa John's pizzas. ... "It wasn't like Bitcoins had any value back then, so the idea of trading them for a pizza was incredibly cool," Hanyecz told the NY Times.
 
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Dave New

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Nov 23, 2020
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Now for my "Doh!" tale.

Many a year ago, I interviewed with a rather young, pre-IPO Microsoft. The position was as an embedded software developer for the Microsoft Mouse (I kid you not), which was still a gleam in Microsoft's eye.

As was Microsoft's M.O. in the day, they offered an insulting salary, but sweetened it with a stock option - 1400 shares. I told the recruiter that I couldn't live off of pre-IPO options, and to ask them for a better offer, which he declined to take to them. Thus, I declined.

Of course, Microsoft stock has split multiple times over the years, and last I looked, those 1400 shares would now be worth over $200 million.

Gasp. Also, of course, the first time they were worth a few thousand, I likely would have sold them off...
 
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Dave

Dave Jenkins, N1MXV
Sep 16, 2020
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Now for my "Doh!" tale.

Many a year ago, I interviewed with a rather young, pre-IPO Microsoft. The position was as an embedded software developer for the Microsoft Mouse (I kid you not), which was still a gleam in Microsoft's eye.

As was Microsoft's M.O. in the day, they offered an insulting salary, but sweetened it with a stock option - 1400 shares. I told the recruiter that I couldn't live off of pre-IPO options, and to ask them for a better offer, which he declined to take to them. Thus, I declined.

Of course, Microsoft stock has split multiple times over the years, and last I looked, those 1400 shares would now be worth over $200 million.

Gasp. Also, of course, the first time they were worth a few thousand, I likely would have sold them off...
I have similar (second hand) stories involving foregone investment opportunities involving nascent Xerox and Land Camera.
Me, I took my pecuniary bath in WANG stock.
 

danlock

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Sep 30, 2020
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@Dave in this thread, your .sig ("Beware the fury of a patient man." - Publilis Syrus, 42 BC) should read "Beware the wealth of a patient man."
 
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iRandy

Member
Nov 17, 2020
9
5
Well, to the best of my recollection, it's (sadly) true that they are not in any computer!
I'm afraid that they almost certainly no longer exist in any digital storage medium. :mad:
@Steve people talk about losing their wallet like it's a magic thing. It's just a convenient way to store and backup your Private Key. Is there any chance you also kept a backup of your private key in your password manager or even printed out on a piece of paper? (That sounds like something you would do)
 

rfrazier

Well-known member
Sep 30, 2020
300
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What the heck. I guess I'll jump in. After @Steve introduced us to Bitcoin, I was mining Litecoin at one time in the past. I was using graphics cards and Litecoin was a better target than Bitcoin. In the end, I probably only recovered my overhead and probably didn't recover my capital. If I looked at the graphics cards as a subsidized cost, I might have made a bit more than the electricity cost. I would convert the fractions of Litecoin into Fractions of Bitcoin. I had been sending some of the little pieces to an exchange once in a while. And I would cash out once in a while. I didn't know it at the time, but people had started using different Bitcoin addresses for each transaction. I think I transferred about 1 Bitcoin to them, but I sent to an old address, which is essentially the same as sending into a black hole. I think they turned out to be disreputable and unreliable. I did have an email dialog with a technician there at one time and they wanted several hundred dollars to dig into the logs and recover my bitcoin. At the time I declined. So I lost ~1 Bitcoin. Like they say, hindsight is 20/20.

Here's some Bitcoin math that will bend your brain a bit. Some of you may know this. Some may not. How much processing power does it take to mine Bitcoin if there's only 1 miner. The answer is, if the miner is only producing the maximum coin quota per day, whatever that is, almost no power. The algorithm is trivial to solve if you're below the quota. Let's say @Steve was the only miner back when (which he wasn't). He could easily mine 50 coins per day or whatever. Of course, they're probably worthless. Now, let's say I join in with the same mining hardware. The algorithm realizes we're now producing 100 coins per day, which isn't allowed. Therefore, the difficulty doubles, so the two of us are again making 50 coins per day total but that means we each only get 25 / day. Now, say 48 more people join with the same hardware. Now we're all still making 50 coins per day total but we're sharing them among 50 people, or 1 coin each. So, keying off the term horsepower, say each miner now has 1 minepower. (I made that up.) Each miner gets (their minepower) / (total minepower) * 50 coins = 1 minepower / 50 minepower * 50 coins. 1 / 50 * 50 = 1 coin each.

Now, what if half the miners want 2 coins per day instead, so they double their hardware. Does it work? NO. The equation for the miners with the big rigs is (2 minepower) / (75 minepower) * 50 coins = 1.333 coins each. The other miners with small rigs get (1 minepower) / (75 minepower) * 50 coins = .666 coins each. So, the people who doubled their rigs got some more money, but not double. The people with the little rigs lost 1/3 of their revenue. So, they say, dang it, we're losing revenue, so they double their rigs too. Now the equation for every miner becomes (2 minepower) / (100 minepower) * 50 coins = ONE COIN EACH. So, now everyone has doubled their rig, and their power consumption, and they're still getting the same revenue. You can imagine the trend with thousands of miners. This is a very hard game to win. The system will tend to gravitate to the point where each miner is just barely making a profit. If there are big profits, more miners jump in and profits go down for the others. If there are little profits, more miners jump out and the profit goes up for the others.

Having said all that, I know how to cut the power consumption of the Bitcoin network by a factor of 10,000. All you have to do is have every miner cut their minepower by a factor of 10,000. BUT, the relationship of each one's minepower to the total network minepower remains the same. THE EXACT SAME NUMBER OF COINS WOULD BE MINTED. This cutting could be done again and again until the lowest common denominator miner is running on a Roku stick or something like it, using 10 watts of power. Again, the EXACT same number of coins would be minted. You make money by the RATIO of your minepower to the minepower of the total network. Is this possible? Probably not. Since people are greedy, there's always going to be the temptation to keep adding hardware to get more of the totally finite Bitcoin pie. But, it's fascinating to think about. Hope you found this interesting.

May your bits be stable and your interfaces be fast. :cool: Ron
 
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Sep 17, 2020
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My fortune in bitcoins is 0.00028856 That was from a promotion Papa John's pizzas were running on 16/5/21 (5/16/21 US, 2021/5/16 so we don't argue over format). That was worth £10.00 way back then! Today at 06:37 it is worth £7.17! (wow that has gone up, couple of days ago it was £6.37). My point is, I am glad I did not "jump on the band waggon", I think I would have slit my wrists by now if that was tens of thousands of pounds. Always remember there are other digital currency available, and buy low, sell high! :)
 

Tazz

Not my real name.
Sep 18, 2020
61
20
Nova Scotia, Canada
Back in the day when Bitcoin was new and shiny I was quite heavily involved with the SETI@Home thing, made it to the top 1% in the world at one point. I had 10 PCs and 5 or 6 video cards looking for aliens 24/7 (is that a universal standard or is it 7/24 somewhere? ;)).
At the time 1 BC was worth +/- $0.008 so I didn't even think of it as viable and just kept on with S@H.

Thinking back, even if I was able to mine any amount of BC I probably would have cashed out when I could have made a couple of hundred dollars and thought I did a great thing.

Now I'm sitting here waiting for someone to invent a system to send emails backward in time. I have some DogeCoin to invest if someone's working on it.
 
Sep 17, 2020
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I was quite heavily involved with the SETI@Home thing
Ahh I did that back in the day. I remember you could set how much processor time you wanted to use & if you wanted to run all the time, not just in screensaver mode. I did it for a few years, but never got anywhere in rankings, or found any signals. Not surprised with you throwing all that hardware at it! To try & up my game I turned everything to 100%; the laptop, an I7 7th gen (impressed eh), got so hot it crashed in about 30 minutes!
 
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